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# htmx-general
  • g
    If you think JS is the worst "cargo cult" -- I would like to introduce you to a Java developer I used to work with...
  • g
    😅
  • g
    idk java has some redeeming qualities in it somewhere.
  • g
    😛
  • g
    javascript's only redeeming quality
  • g
    The language, sure. But the people...
  • g
    is that it enabled htmx to exist.
  • g
    😛
  • g
    okay i'm gonna go watch the cowboys play and yell at my tv screen until i fall asleep
  • g
    hope ya'll have a night as good as mine
  • g
    I'd say it's also good because it's everywhere. (Insincere arguments about progressive enhancement aside) Javascript may not be great, but you know it'll run wherever you put it.
  • g
    You couldn't even say that about Java applets, or Flash back in their heyday.
  • g
    I have never run afoul of a Haskell guy. What's that like 😉
  • j
    Really confusing when they start warning you about monads.
  • j
    I will say that I very much like the HOWL approach. I don't think HTMX and a web components approach are actually mutually exclusive.
  • g
    Yes. I agree. I dug into WebComponents, and they have SO.. MUCH.. PROMISE. If they work for you, then go for it. It was too much for me to work with at the time. Hyperscript behaviors have been more my speed. But they're essentialy two paths up the same mountain, and both pair nicely with htmx.
  • m
    it was unfortunate to see some folks saying: "Well, I guess we don't need to look at htmx now" in the comments, but such is life
  • m
    i wish it were possible to have positive and good faith disagreements
  • m
    as I said in the essay, htmx isn't right for everything and I'm sure svelte is extremely useful in many situations
  • j
    You were never going to get those people anyway. Like they say, never wrestle with pigs. You all get dirty, but the pigs enjoy it.
  • m
  • j
    Watch me follow my own advice 🙂
  • n
    Good essay with a lot of visibility. Still I don’t understand the anti-js emphasis TBH the only thing it does is alienate people and make it easy to ignore very good arguments. I know this is unsolicited advice but I would focus on the benefits of HTML over the wire instead of all the we don’t like JS thing. ✌️
  • a
    Guys as someone new to htmx and this community I'm really excited and enjoying hacking in my spare time. So hopefully I can be impartial and say people need to be careful because it's a young project. @gentle-dream-18175 said earlier that there are a lot of idioms still to be figured out. Yes there are resources out there but they are still rough around the edges. Work needs to be done to show people how to do non trivial sets of things and organize non trivial code bases, I'm excited to help
  • g
    I agree with your point. When htmx comes off as anti-js, that's when we lose people's attention. It's happened on twitter before.
  • g
    I think htmx is pro common sense, which is at odds with what the JavaScript community is doing these days.
  • g
    I'd say, javascript adds complexity, and if we can achieve the same thing with less complexity, that's a win. But run that through a twitter feed and it comes out as "JS, bad. Hulk smash"
  • m
    😀 ranting incoherently about javascript is just too much in my nature at times. I will try to control it.
  • m
    But js bad, hulk smash
  • g
    My wife is giving me that funny look, like, why are you laughing and snorting, Ben?
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