https://frumfinance.slack.com/archives/C04G41ZD725/p1677075236717429 I'd love to hear everyone's thoughts/psakim

I was told no for me 5 yr old daughter. IIUC there is more of a reason to be matir for a boy over 6 who is מחויב בתלמוד תורה and is a חיוב צדקה for the parents.

Main thread in #C04G41ZD725 here: https://frumfinance.slack.com/archives/C04G41ZD725/p1677075236717429

I heard that for boys you can't. But also let's say you pay 500 you can make an agreement with school that your price is 250 and you need to cover the rest through fundraising and then use maaser for that (kind of a loophole I guess 🤷‍♂️ but heard from a dayen)

@limited-shoe-91179 that is both illegal in regards to considering it a donation, and every Rov I asked said it doesn't count as maiser if you do that. Just so you know 🤷‍♂️

And from Mr GPT

Where does that say you can do a partial tuition payment as real and part as fundraising?

Nowhere, just on this topic.....

Yeah my point is just that you can do what you suggested, not that you can't count tuition as maiser.

You can use maaser without it being considered tax deductible, it doesn't have to be synonymous (not commenting on this case in particular, just in general).

Very true! (Not related to my illegal or against halachah commebt though, but yes, I agree!)

I heard a podcast a while ago - I think it was this one - where an administrator said that they made a deal with the parent body: we will reduce full tuition by 1/3, but it is only feasible if fundraising / donations make up the shortfall in aggregate. It was an official lawyer-vetted approach so there might be some precedent for that type of deal. (I am also familiar with schools that have a give or get obligation where each family can fundraise $1500 or just donate it themselves, which is the same idea)

In the Kosher Money episode with Rabbi Kushner on Ma'aser, he suggested not committing to pay the full tuition they are asking, and coming to an agreement as to what the minimum required amount would be. That would be your obligation that cannot come from maser funds. Any additional amount which you "will try to pay if you can" can come from maser. Practically speaking, if there is a contract where you fully obligate yourself to the agreed amount, this wouldn't work

@bright-restaurant-33087 that works when the institution does it as a whole and actually lowers tuition, it doesn’t work if its only for one family or case by case.

(I am also familiar with schools that have a give or get obligation where each family can fundraise $1500 or just donate it themselves, which is the same idea)

This one you can’t do if its a chiyuv to either fundraise it or give it. Once its a chiyuv, its tax fraud.

If he fundraises, is it not tax deductible for the donors because it's to credit a specific person's account? And if it is tax deductible for donor's , why can't he be his own donor

the moment you HAVE to give a donation, its not a donation. Whether its from someone else, or from yourself. When you declare a donation you sign an agreement that formally says “I do not receive any benefit from giving this money”. I can get the formal language if you want.