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# microsoft-fslogixs
Slackbot
08/15/2019, 1:34 PMThis message was deleted.
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Jarian Gibson
08/15/2019, 1:35 PMI know FSLogix did some testing a while back of files vs block which would be similar.
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Nick Casagrande
08/15/2019, 1:36 PMdid it show block was better?
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Nick Panaccio
08/15/2019, 1:37 PM@Leee Jeffries Any chance you tested this with UPM? I know you did it with FSLogix.
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 1:38 PMI performed testing on IO for OST caching using FSLogix Profile Disks so can give sizing for that. We did redirect an OST file directly to a share for comparison. The latency goes through the roof and the Outlook performance is poor.
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 1:39 PMBascially the IO on VHD container is significantly reduced compared to file based IO. When I say significant I mean 30% of files based IO or less dependent on use case.
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James Rankin
08/15/2019, 1:47 PMInteresting observation re. VHD versus filesystem - when someone misconfigured Trend in our environment so that everything was double-scanned, a UPM logon took 18 minutes. With FSLogix, it only took 1 minute. Processing all those files takes a long time in UPM
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Nick Panaccio
08/15/2019, 1:48 PMHow the hell does Trend scan everything twice? Unless they didn't run TCacheGen before it was sealed...
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 1:49 PMI think we were on the same point there James. I've not done packet traces or anything but I would assume the SMB overhead would be relatively hefty on the storage for file based interaction.
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James Rankin
08/15/2019, 1:50 PMIt scans at the fileserver end and at the client end, if you've got muppets for admins
James Rankin
08/15/2019, 1:51 PMAnd locks each file while being scanned
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 1:51 PMLuckily UPM logging is pretty good with stuff like that and if you're quick enough you can catch it 😉
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Nick Panaccio
08/15/2019, 1:51 PMMuppets? Nice to know I'm not the only one using that term. 😄
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Jarian Gibson
08/15/2019, 1:52 PMI will be doing more test, but have seen similar with container vs file based solutions.
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James Rankin
08/15/2019, 1:52 PMLuckily I eat my own dog food so I pretty much spotted it straight away and cut Trend's throat 🙂
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 1:53 PMPeople always think I'm crazy when I'm building out and environment and start using it pretty much right away. I'm glad I'm not the only crazy one 😉
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Jarian Gibson
08/15/2019, 1:54 PMBest way to improve things
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Tim Riegler
08/15/2019, 1:54 PMIt's how we run as well. All Systems team runs the new builds first. Best way to find the big problems
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 1:54 PMIn my view yes, it also helps when users start complaining about something, you can straight away rule out the most obvious things if you're okay.
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Tim Riegler
08/15/2019, 2:09 PM@Nick Casagrande I'd like to know as well - UPM vs. FSLogix. Been investigating and asking questions for a while, and can't seem to find an answer. We are currently migrating to FSL from UPM for our new 2016 build, due to Chrome being stupid, as well as Start Menu / Task bar oddities. I was tired of troubleshooting UPM, and so we decided to bite the bullet.
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Nick Casagrande
08/15/2019, 2:11 PMseems the consenus is block is better than file, which is what i was expecting
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Jarian Gibson
08/15/2019, 2:16 PMIt is because of mounting a entire VHD/VHDX as single transaction versus file accessing every file as a single transaction. I do like flexibility of hybrid though.
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Tim Riegler
08/15/2019, 2:22 PMRight - even though the mount is fast, all IO is still processed on the file server. Unlike UPM, which once files are streamed, the IO is processed on the VM (in RAM, typically). The question becomes - what are the storage performance ramifications of moving from UPM to FSL, as now the file server has to handle 100% of the profile IO, all the time.
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Jarian Gibson
08/15/2019, 2:24 PMYep great points. Also active write back can play a factor as well. Enabling can kill file server.
Jarian Gibson
08/15/2019, 2:24 PMAlso look at network transactions, bandwidth, etc of file vs block
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Nick Panaccio
08/15/2019, 2:24 PMThat's one reason why we decided to put our FSL containers on flash storage.
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Tim Riegler
08/15/2019, 2:25 PMThat will be our next decision point. Thankfully storage motion is a thing =D
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Nick Panaccio
08/15/2019, 2:25 PMI enjoyed the "you want how much storage?!" replies.
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Tim Riegler
08/15/2019, 2:26 PMlol. right? As my team also manages storage, that was pretty much an internal gasp
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 2:28 PMThat can be pretty hefty, try to utilise storage with DeDupe if possible, that does save a lot of space. I did do IOPs sizing on the O365 with Outlook. It probably needs a re-do with all the latest additions but its no small task.
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Nick Panaccio
08/15/2019, 2:30 PMFunny, I found out a few weeks ago that we only have compression enabled, not dedupe.
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 2:45 PMIts all about the planning when it comes to storage. Compression is sometimes a little slower on performance due to the overhead but it all depends on the hardware and use case.
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Nick Panaccio
08/15/2019, 2:45 PMThis would be EMC VMAX.
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 2:46 PMGood stuff then 😉
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Julian Mooren
08/15/2019, 6:23 PMIs there a known issue with Sophos AV and FSLogix? Getting an EA error when trying to connect the profile container. Without the Sophos agent everything is working. Couldn’t find any information in the FSLogix or Sophos KB
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 6:24 PMNot that I know of. vhdx / vhd files do need to be excluded though.
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Julian Mooren
08/15/2019, 6:32 PMThe Sophos administrator is in holiday this week. Can’t make any modifications about the exclusions. Will give it a new try next week ✌🏼VHD exclude is the first thing came to my mind. Until now I hadn’t problems with other AV vendors.
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Leee Jeffries
08/15/2019, 6:36 PMIt's just during the initial attach that I've seen it cause an issue but it's pretty rare imo too. The contents of the vhd will be scanned as normal once attached.
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Julian Mooren
08/15/2019, 6:40 PMSounds logical. I will find out next week
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BobFrankly
08/19/2019, 5:06 PMIf you're doing windows Server de-dupe, keep in mind that deletes don't free up space immediately, Gotta run that Start-DedupJob garbageCollection cmdlet
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